Another moron who doesn't get Ben.

[zulater]

http://www.bizjournals.com/pittsburgh/s ... ily19.html

and another

http://www.faniq.com/blog/Ben-Roethlisb ... Blog-28990

I feel the best way to put it is to quote Bill Evengal, 'here's your sign.'

[Coot]

“You need haters. What the **** is you complaining about? What the **** do you think a haters job is? To ****ing hate. So let them mother****er do their goddamn job. What the **** is you complaining about? Ladies if you got 14 women hating on you, you need to figure out how the **** to get to 16 before the summer get here. What the **** is you mad about? Fellas if you got 20 haters, you need 40 of them mother****ers. What is you complaining about? If there’s any haters in here right now that don’t have nobody to hate on, feel free to hate on me.”

-Katt Williams-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxxPLDZnqwA&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fdoubleyourgains.com%2Fhow-to-deal-with-haters&feature=player_embedded#t=25

As Katt Williams says, the more haters you have, the more successful you are (in not so many words).

[Dwinsgames]

As Katt Williams says, the more haters you have, the more successful you are (in not so many words).

[gut]

You give Ben a chance late in the 4th quarter, you're pretty much going to lose. Whiz knew it. Fisher knows it now, too.

Most games these days in the NFL are decided late in the 4th quarter.

Therefore, Ben is the best QB in the league.......Q.E.D.

[DSH_97]

There's quite a few out there that simply refuse to see or understanding the love affair Steelers fans have with Ben as their QB. They seem to think Steelers fans are just homers when it comes to Ben, but that could be further from the truth. Value comes in more forms than simple minded stats. So the only thing left here, is to watch Ben take another Superbowl in the next few months or so.

Respect, like simple minded stats, come in many ways also.

[gut]

Brady had his critics and really didn't get mentioned as elite and/or with Manning until half-way thru their 3rd title run.

Also, Ben is just entering his 6th season, and neither Brady nor Manning were the QB's they are today at that point. Manning didn't become "GOAT" until about his 6th season. Brady was consistently very good from about his 3rd year, but never put up the eye-popping fantasy stats to get his due credit. Finally got some receivers and then put up monster numbers in '07.

And, of course, Ben has put up better numbers than Elway to date. Elway would get little respect in today's fantasy stat driven media. His numbers were actually rather ordinary - except when it counted.

I still can't get over how quick the media is to annoit a Rivers or, worse, Aaron Rodgers while respect for Ben comes begrudgingly at best. Rivers and Brees play on loaded offenses and feast on weak opponents, but to-date have not played all that great in big games. Apparently, piling on numbers against inferior opponents is what constitutes elite these days.

Just strikes me as comical how Ben's game is dissected in minutia to find things to criticize, while guys like Rivers get a pass (last night, the announcer were even making excuses for him).

[BenMorgan]

the line in journo's heads between Fantasy Football ans actual Football is non existent.

[TB]

Ben has only thrown over 20 TDs in a season once in his career. Until he starts doing that consistently, he's just not going to get the credit I think he really deserves. He needs to back up the wins with better stats before a lot of the people on the fence about him hop on the bandwagon.

[Master Blaster]

Ben has only thrown over 20 TDs in a season once in his career. Until he starts doing that consistently, he's just not going to get the credit I think he really deserves. He needs to back up the wins with better stats before a lot of the people on the fence about him hop on the bandwagon.

I couldn't care less about Ben's fantasy stats. He wins. That's all that matters.

[Lemonhead]

Ben has only thrown over 20 TDs in a season once in his career. Until he starts doing that consistently, he's just not going to get the credit I think he really deserves. He needs to back up the wins with better stats before a lot of the people on the fence about him hop on the bandwagon.

I couldn't care less about Ben's fantasy stats. He wins. That's all that matters.

[HazMat]

I gotta agree with gut's take on this. In today's fantasy-stat driven NFL, the pundits who commentate on the game, with a few exceptions(Cowherd comes to mind, he loves Ben), look at TD passes over wins to determine who's the top of the crop. I guess on one level I can understand that perspective, but in the grand scheme, wins are all that matter and should hold priority over TD passes in regards to QBs...especially when you're talking about a QB like Ben, who for the last couple years has carried his team to many wins.

[Mongoose]

My complaints about Ben's game have evaporated one by one over the course of his career. He currently is playing QB for a team with no running game, and he keeps coming back to win games in the 4th quarter. The Steelers can't play with a lead, but that's not Ben's fault. When they get a lead, they take the ball out of his hands and hope that Kemo can channel the ghost of Alan Faneca.

I'd be willing to lump Ben in with, say, Donovan McNabb--a quarterback who gets a lot of positive heat playing with an elite defense--except that Ben has reached a point where he can operate that no-huddle spread, win games under extreme pressure, and collect Super Bowl rings.

As for Ben's publicity coming from being a member of the Steelers: Remember when the media was hailing Cliff Stoudt, Mark Malone, Kordell Stewart, and Tommy Maddox as Hall-of-Famers?

Neither do I.

[Blackwolf]

My complaints about Ben's game have evaporated one by one over the course of his career. He currently is playing QB for a team with no running game, and he keeps coming back to win games in the 4th quarter. The Steelers can't play with a lead, but that's not Ben's fault. When they get a lead, they take the ball out of his hands and hope that Kemo can channel the ghost of Alan Faneca.

Which might be at least remotely possible if Alan Faneca weren't still alive.

[wineshard]

Ben - 2 rings

Drew Brees - 0 Rings


Should I illustrate this for anyone in the national media?

[DSH_97]

The only ones that can't understand that fact are Patriots fans....

[Steeler7588]

Ben - 2 rings
Drew Brees - 0 Rings

Should I illustrate this for anyone in the national media?

Man, I hate s#%t like this. I think Ben is better, but you can't honestly deny that Brees is a phenomenal player. That his team sucks isn't his fault. Judging a player on how many rings he has is as lazy as judging him on his stats.

[HazMat]

Ben - 2 rings
Drew Brees - 0 Rings

Should I illustrate this for anyone in the national media?

Man, I hate s#%t like this. I think Ben is better, but you can't honestly deny that Brees is a phenomenal player. That his team sucks isn't his fault. Judging a player on how many rings he has is as lazy as judging him on his stats.

I don't think he's making the argument that Brees is trash. He's simply stating which player has rings and which doesn't. Rings put major distance between you and the other guys playing QB in the league, no matter how good you are. Ask Jim Kelly if he'd trade his HOF jacket for a SB ring. My guess would be he'd do it in a heart beat.

[wineshard]

Ben - 2 rings
Drew Brees - 0 Rings

Should I illustrate this for anyone in the national media?

Man, I hate s#%t like this. I think Ben is better, but you can't honestly deny that Brees is a phenomenal player. That his team sucks isn't his fault. Judging a player on how many rings he has is as lazy as judging him on his stats.

Drew Brees is a fantasy god, where Ben is a champion. 10 years from now no one is going to remember Drew f#@&ing Brees, 25 years from now people will know the name Ben Roethlisberger, not for his Fantasy stats, but for the multiple digits on his hand covered in bling. Judging the rings on a players finger is ultimately the only valid way to judge a player (except Dan Marino).

[Steeler7588]

Judging the rings on a players finger is ultimately the only valid way to judge a player (except Dan Marino).

No, it's not valid. It's a team f#@&ing sport. You making Marino the exception reveals how arbitrary an evaluation it is. Oh, the "nobody will remember Brees in 10 years" - laughable. Especially given your Marino comment.

[COStillersFan]

Stats and championships are generally both good ways to judge a QB - guys that are great in one, but not the other, COULD still be considered great, but I think we all know who is great just by the way they play on the field. Guys like Scott Mitchell have put up great stats, and Dilfer has a SB ring, but there were plenty of QBs in the league at that same time that were simply better QBs.

Now-a-days, I think that Brady, Brees and Peyton would have just as good of a chance of leading the Steelers to the SB as Big Ben, but that's it. People that try to put Ben in a lower tier with Eli, Rivers, and Culter, are to me, simply asinine. However, people that state because Brees has no SB rings, that he isn't as good as Ben, are just as off-base.

[Steeler7588]

I think we all know who is great just by the way they play on the field.

This.

[wineshard]

Oh, the "nobody will remember Brees in 10 years" - laughable. Especially given your Marino comment.

Ok, you are right, 10 years from now the people that had him on their fantasy league and won championships will remember him, I guess that counts for more than no one.

And this is why Dan Marino is remembered.

Dan Marino
http://www.danmarino.com/Stats.aspx

If you would like to compare him to Drew Brees:

Drew Brees
http://www.nfl.com/players/drewbrees/profile?id=BRE229498

BTW, how many playoff games has Drew Brees even won?

[Steeler7588]

10 years from now the people that had him on their fantasy league and won championships will remember him, I guess that counts for more than no one.

And this is why Dan Marino is remembered.
http://www.danmarino.com/Stats.aspx

Man, looks like Marino was the ultimate fantasy quarterback, eh? But sure, keep ignoring that Brees is probably the most likely QB to ever break Marino's single season records, which in your opinion is the reason why Marino is so respected.

BTW, how many playoff games has Drew Brees even won?

One. The Saints have also never ranked better than 23rd in defense since he's been their starter. But I'm sure that has nothing to do with anything.

Brees or Eli? Who is better?

[zulater]

Brees is the only reason the Saints are watchable. He could win a Super Bowl if he was on a team with a better defense.

[wineshard]

Brees or Eli? Who is better?

What do you think?